Virginia Beach
Cyclists have fallen in love with Pungo and its scenic rural roads.
But the feeling isn’t necessarily mutual.
Pedalers and the residents who live in southern Virginia Beach have been at odds in recent years. Bicyclists complain that drivers have purposely brushed by them or tried to edge them off the road. Residents grouse that the bikers sometimes ride in packs, block traffic and litter.
Now, a mildly worded resolution that supports cyclists is drawing controversy. The resolution, backed by Councilwoman Rosemary Wilson, encourages city staff to consider cyclists when they design road repavement or maintenance projects.
Paving an additional 2 -foo t-wide stretch of city right-of-way for cyclists would cost $80,000 a mile, Wilson said.
“To me, it’s a common-sense safety idea,” Wilson said. “At least if it’s wider, it’s safer.”
Wilson had planned to introduce the resolution at last week’s City Council meeting. But it met objections from Councilwoman Barbara Henley, who lives in the Pungo area and represents the Princess Anne District.
The Beach’s Agricultural Advisory Commission will now review the resolution before the council considers it. The commission is scheduled to discuss the proposal on Monday.
“Are we really intending every roadway in the city to be a bike and trailway?” Henley asked. “I don’t know if that’s the right thing.”
The roads around Pungo are narrow and barely can accommodate the cars and trucks added by residential growth, Henley said.
The city shouldn’t encourage cycling on roads that aren’t safe, she added.
“We’ve got to have a reality check here,” Henley said. “If it’s a substandard road, and there are people who have no choice but to be on the roads, what do you do when people want to use the roads for recreation? It’s not 'Do you like bikers or do you not like bikers?’ It’s a safety issue.”
For Chris Logan, a Kempsville resident, Pungo is the safest place in Virginia Beach to ride a bike because the roads aren’t clogged with cars and trucks.
“I’m not going to ride my bike down Indian River Road,” he said. “The law says I have as much right to be on the road as they do.”
Logan cycles through Pungo about three times a week and also participates in the organized rides put on by several local bike clubs and stores.
These rides have fueled some of the backlash from the community.
“It used to be cute 10 years ago to see a few bicyclists on a Sunday,” said Gene Hansen, president of the Back Bay-Pungo Civic League. “Now they’re out in the mornings and out midday.”
Many Pungo residents don’t let their children ride their bikes from one farm to another because the roads are too dangerous, and having the cyclists here adds to their concern, Hansen said.
The next civic league meeting, set for March, will be dedicated to the issue of sharing the road with cyclists, said Hansen, who supports the resolution.
Tom Coghill, president of the Tidewater Bicycle Association, said Wilson’s resolution would be the first step in making roads safer for bikers and drivers.
“It gives us a place to ride, and nobody will be nervous,” Coghill said.
Deirdre Fernandes, (757) 222-5121, deirdre.fernandes@pilotonline.com
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Oh yeah, one more thing.
For all those that would like to see injury or death come to anyone for such a reason as they ride a bike (even if they aren't riding the way you think they should), you may want to see a psychiatrist or consider accepting Jesus as your personal savior. Your attitude and lack of respect for human life are pretty maniacal. We shall call you the car NAZIS. Then again, maybe I'll look into your way of thinking; "Look at that mother of 3 going 5 mph over the speed limit, I hope she crashes into a tree and dies or becomes paralized." Nah, that isn't how I want to be known.
My favorite HIPPO-Crits
I love to see the anti-bike folks point out, "they run lights" or "they don't stop at signs." I drive a car and I ride a bike and let me say that ABSOLUTELY nobody is obeying the law. Yeah right, tell me you go the speed limit or stop everytime the light turns yellow; I'll call you a liar to your face. Let me say that I'm also enjoying the ad-hominem attacks: "brain dead," "stupid," etc. I guess if you drive a 3500+ lb vehicle and you don't get your way, everyone else is an idiot. I can't wait until gas is $6 or $8 a gallon and you whine even harder.
Don't know what to do anymore.....
I've read just about all the comments here. As a cyclist & a motorist, in general, drivers piss me off! When I'm in my car I see a lot more IDIOTS than when I'm on my bike. When I ride in Pungo I can generally count on one hand the number of cars that pass me. WHAT'S THE BIG DEAL?!?! People FLY around me when I ride AND when I DRIVE MY CAR!!! No matter what road I'm on.
I understand the frustration on both sides, BUT.....if you can't wait a minute of two for me to safely get from point "A" to point "B".....IN MY CAR.....then you should take a laxative and CHILL OUT!!! I DO have a right, by law, to ride on the same roads I drive on. Just think.....we mostly ride in Pungo where there's not a lot of cars. What if we went down General Booth Blvd or Virginia Beach Blvd?! Like I said....I DO have that right if I so choose. Think about it for a minute......
responsibility
Some excerpts from previous posts:
~~~~~~~~~
Narrow country roads with blind curves
They are barely acceptable and challenging even for autos.
~~~~~~~~~
If you enter a blind corner unable to avoid an obstacle, then you are at fault if you hit someone. Or do you say young children crossing with a parent or teacher is at fault when you plough into them, killing seven???
Or a semi broke down and you plough into it, killing yourself.
It's stupid to speed into blind corners. If you can't see around the corner, SLOW DOWN. Maybe the speed limit should be lowered.
The auto-centricity of our society will end - too bad it can't all happen in our lifetimes - mass transit will replace all those cars, but there will be more bikes than ever!
cycling
We cyclists are not trying to say we are perfect. I and my teammates have yelled plenty times at fellow riders who are unsafe. We do need to be single file as often as we can. Drivers need to realize that if we are not single file it is often because the guy in front is tired and they are falling back to take their place at the end of the line. If we are approaching a stop sign (like the picture shows) we will fan out so as not to run into the rider ahead of us.
Drivers also need to realize that we ride in the country so we don't have to stop every minute at a light or a stop sign. We are not foreigners; we could be your next door neighbor.
design engineer + cyclist
I am a design engineer who works very closely with the City's in Hampton Roads. First of all $80,000 for 2'wide mile long paved road is grossly over estimated. Excluding excavation I would estimate it at $30,000, maybe add another 10grand for excavating. Cycling is growing exponentionally each year, so you better get used to us, we are taking over! Pungo is the safest place to ride for serious cyclists. I can't account for those out on a leisurely ride. There are a few bad cyclists out there giving us a bad wrap though for sure. I wiz past them on my bike almost every saturday and sunday morning.
I have no problem
With bikes on the road. They are out there doing something they enjoy and so what if it takes you a few extra minutes to get some where. What I hate is those on the bikes who really could care less about the rules - they ride the wrong way down the street and have no regard for the traffic lights. I understand the bike may be the only way they have to get to work, but you know you are on the road like every one else....pay attention when you ride and respect those on the road... not only 4 wheels but 2 wheels as well.....
Still the Same Stupid Remarks
I wish to address some of the responses. 1) I am a cyclist and a motorist. It appears that this concept is foreign to residents of Hampton Roads. Let me explain. I not only ride my bicycle, I drive a vehicle. In addition, I paid taxes not only on my vehicle; but, my bicycle, when I bought them both. Not only that, I am a homeowner and I am pretty sure the city of Virginia Beach enjoys the real estate taxes they collect.
2) Cyclists need to be more courteous. Single file guys. It is not that difficult.
3) This could be a win-win if we all worked together. The roads in Pungo are narrow. They would be narrow if cyclists were not out there. Why not use this as an opportunity to work to widen them together?
Always the automobile drivers fault?
William says "In fact, if there is an auto accident involving a bicyclist, it is presumed that the driver of the auto is at fault initially."
That's absurd. That's like saying a guys crashes into the side of another car because he ran a green light.
Bike Riding in Pungo
Most of the roads in Virginia Beach are very unsafe, and often drivers are preoccupied with use of the cell phone. The Pungo area has very few cars, and therefore it a very safe place to bike, in comparison with the rest of the city.
I believe we can have bike lanes on as many roads as possible. This summer I went on a week-long bike ride in Alaska. All of the major roads have bike lanes. In addition, drivers treat cyclists with utmost respect -something that does not happen around here. In fact, if there is an auto accident involving a bicyclist, it is presumed that the driver of the auto is at fault initially. That is not true here.
Cyclists and Drivers...
"Wm D Tabor DDS said: driving the 35 limit on New Bridge Rd, I have come around a curve to find a pack of cyclists in front of me and have been forced to veer into the other lane to avoid them. ..oblivious to the fact that had there been a car in the other lane and I had not been able to go around them, they would have been struck and perhaps killed."
Dr Tabor, cyclists do sometimes ride in wide packs to be visible. The S turn on New Bridge is very dangerous & is partially blind. The blind areas mean you can’t see oncoming traffic as you try to pass. If you were to pass in this area & a car happened to enter the turn you would be forced to push the cyclist off the road or have an accident. Is the extra 30 seconds to get out of that curve to pass the bike in a safer area really worth risking an accident or injured cyclist? Hopefully your patients are treated with more patience than the people you share the road with!
and
and one more thing - $80,000 a mile for an extra two feet? I need to be in the road building business...
or try being polite?
Ah, once again a story about rude bikers and rude drivers. Wonder how many problems there would be if people would just be polite?
Bikers - you will follow the rules of the road. You will stop a stop lights and not keep going if they are red. You will ride at the speed limit. You will not ride more than one abreast. You will signal your intentions.
Drivers - you will allow bikers room, you won't cut bikers off, you will signal your intentions.
Police - you will ticket bikers that are riding in packs, below the speed limit and obstructing traffic.
That's all it takes.
the picture
I have read many comments concerning the picture and how these cyclists are "blocking" the road. These guys are coming to a stop sign and are withing thear rights to spread out to stop. this serves two purposes one makes it easier for driver to see they are stopping and two keeps driver from pulling up right next to them at the stop.
I am a cyclist and yes there are bike paths I have ruined three sets of wheels on these :bike paths" at about 700 a set. these are also pedestrian paths, cyclist going 30 hits pedestrian not a good mix.
I love riding out in pungo don't often ride in the large groups anymore try to stick to 10-15 riders at most.
the fact is wrong is done on both motorists and cyclists and not all of each group. As a cyclist I pay taxes on three cars, a house and a town home. I generally ride to and from work weather permitting. saving my money do to gas costs. these narrow roads are truly that but the wide roads are NO safer!
Bike Riders Have No Business On Our Roads, Go to a Park.
Some of the Bike riders out there think they have a right to drive down the middle of a road well below the speed limit and impede traffic. Using their logic, I guess I have a right to go running down the middle of any road I like. I would never do such a thing because I would be inviting serious bodily harm to myself and have found safe places to run with minimal risk to myself. The mentality of these mental midgets really comes out when I travel the back roads of Chesapeake on my way to Northwest River Park when the corn is reaching maturity. The roads have relatively high speed limits, no shoulder, ditches just feet from the edge, often do not have paint down the middle between lanes, and have severly limited visibility. These folks could be riding on some of the scenic bike paths provided all around this regions, yet they choose to risk their lives for some kind of anti-social political statement. I have no sympathy for these folks when I read about them bitng the dust along roads they have no business traveling.
Cyclists
Amy says "you can't claim that these people haven't paid taxes because I'm willing to bet that the majority of these weekend cyclists drive cars etc. during the rest of the week and they too pay gas taxes, car registration fees, personal property tax etc."
The cyclists are asking government to put taxes that motorists have paid to maintain roads for wider than needed roads that cost "$80,000 a mile" (according to Rosemary Wilson) and separate bike trails that benefit their own recreation. If it is going to cost additional funds to accomodate cyclists, then they should be required to pony up additional funds.
Bikes on the road
Take a drive down Damneck or London Bridge extended and you'll see these geniuses ignoring a perfectly good bike path and riding on the road.
From Virginiarider99
"cyclist don't enjoy making drivers angry, but if need be we will" Kind of sums up the whole thing doesn't it... Do me a favor, don't ever ride in my neighborhood.
Bikers
While I agree that the rude cyclists out there give it a bad name, you can't claim that these people haven't paid taxes because I'm willing to bet that the majority of these weekend cyclists drive cars etc. during the rest of the week and they too pay gas taxes, car registration fees, personal property tax etc. Therefore they have just as much right to the road as anyone else... that being said... they are stupid if they feel that their rights to the road entitle them to be rude and block traffic. FURTHERMORE.... how on earth is it going to cost an extra $80,000 for an extra 2 feet of road per mile? Isn't that a bit excessive? Lets use common sense people...
Motorists / Cyclists
If you want motorists to share the road with cyclists, then cyclists have to share the costs with motorists. Nuff said!