Legislation would extend light rail to Virginia Beach

Subsidies by taxpayers to free enterprise is the topic of my discussion. Subsidies to the light rail system will be massive. Even back when the private firms GM, Firestone, and Standard Oil of California, between 1936 and 1950, bought out more than 100 electric surface-traction systems in 45 cities to be dismantled and replaced with GM buses, massive government funds were necessary to build the road system to replace the trolleys with the cars, trucks and buses. The trolley system, the moribund system of private enterprise that had collapsed in the 1930s was dismantled. The federal government provided huge subsidies of taxpayers funds to shift the nation to complete motorization. This decision was made by the government, business and the public who wanted the freedom that motorization afforded. Today most of our goods are delivered by truck and most of our personal commuting is by automobile. The public has voted Not to the high subsidies for light rail. To revert back to "trolleys" is foolish and will cost the taxpayer Millions of dollars in subsidies.

The rail systems in use everywhere else in the world and that existed here United States for generations were bought up by companies such as General Motors and Standard Oil and driven to the ground on purpose. Then after they abandoned the streetcars and tore them apart, everyone was dependent on their product. It's not "the market" and it's not a conspiracy, it's basic history. You can look it up: http://www.google.com/search?q=national+city+lines&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

Wood is right - most people from Virginia Beach aren't going to downtown Norfolk. They should have done it right the first time and built light rail down the median of I-64 to the Naval Base instead of the perpetually underused HOV lanes we have now.

Sometime in the next few decades, Is it impossible? For a real oil crisis to occur, or possibly just an oil embargo, another hurricane in the gulf? Are these crazy thoughts, who ever would have predicted The Great Depression? Something may happen in the next century that would require people to commute without gas. Maybe we'll have electric cars or hydrogen...or maybe not. Think!

Exactly what part of the State or US Constitution covers the governments role to do the things you mention. Your desires that you mention always increases the debt for the taxpayer in order to increase the profits for the developer. The free enterprise system is exactly that- free enterprise. If a developer feels that a project is worthwhile, then he should invest in it and take his chances to earn a profit. The government must neither hinder nor enhance this uniquely American system of free enterprise. To do so creates a socialist type system where the government controls development, not the developer or the citizen. I do not understand why the government feels correct in interfering where it has no Constitutional right to do so. I wish you all the luck in the world with your developments, just don't look to the taxpayer or the government to create or enhance the opportunities. You need to

Oh, so you are saying roads are self supporting? Transit oriented development can be as follows: Transportation projects, for example, can increase adjacent land values, and thus generate a windfall for private landowners. Public agencies can with proper preparation and foresight capture a portion of that windfall with any of the following methods: 1) local improvement districts; 2) public-private development of adjacent land; 3) traffic impact fees; 4) tax increment financing districts; or 5) buying privately held land near transportation hubs that is zoned for low-density use on the open market, increasing the designated use density, then selling the land back to private developers on the open market, capturing the capital gain resulting from both the increase in designated use density and the presence of the transportation hub. As a private developer in Hampton Roads, I

Light rail is costing 232M dollars in Norfolk for 7.4 miles of track plus the terminals, overpasses and infrastructure improvements. the line to the VB Convention Center will cost more. The system will run at a loss and will have to be subsidized to the tune of millions of dollars for the sake of a few who cannot afford to or wish not to drive. The taxes in the Hampton Roads region are stifling now - imagine if we get light rail expenditures to subsidize also. Many more people will be on the verge of financial collapse as the job market is not keeping pace with the cost of living. Jobs being created are low paying service and seasonal compared to the jobs being lost. Mass transit is a product of a charitable and giving government who wishes to collect tax money to give to or subsidize the less fortunate. This is not the governments function. The Constitution is not inclusive of Charity. The redistribu

Quote: "I have no doubt that the increase in real estate value of the property around light rail will escalate greatly in value and private owners invest billions to create higher value, multi use projects. Is this simply speculation? No. One only has to look at similar projects in Baltimore, San Jose, Portland, Kansas City, and many other cities..."

Do your research Mike. No one wants to live next to a RR track with trains passing at all hours. Residential real estate values plummeted in St Louis and Charlotte along the route and residents are none to happy with that or the noise and congestion. Both projects were grossly over budget. Charlotte by over 100%. Both projects were late and St Louis was plagued with lawsuits. Don't start with the tired crap about all projects being grossly over budget. Highway const avg is 10% over.

Look at the route of Marta. Not past nice residences due to noise,

I agree such attitudes did, and do exist. However, your brush is to wide. The majority of the residents of what is now VB settled here because of the military. Most people have no ties to the area to link them to the formation of the new cities.

Just read a few of the comments on the poll section of this article; I see some of our ciizens still have attitudes of yesteryear. What a shame.

For all of you too young in age or too new to the area to know, light rail doesn't already exist in this area because of the the attitudes of many leaders & residents of Va. Beach toward Norfolk, for far too many years. One of the main reasons Va. Beach exists as it is & not as a 2square mile town, is that in the late '50's, Norfolk, dealing with a growing population in a small area, wanted to annex much of the surrounding counties of Norfolk County & Princess Anne County. Norfolk, after giving up on Massive Resistance, had began to integrate their public schools. Wealthy, well connected families in these two counties, didn't want to be annexed & used their influence to have the state legislature pass bills to create Chesapeake, out of Norfolk County & the small city of South Norfolk, & Va. Beach out of P.A. County & the small town of Va. Beach. White flight & greedy developers had much to do with the rapid

Again our separate city governments bite the region in the backside. Because of it, we don't have a chance at master planning for the entire region unless it is imposed on us by Richmond. We should have a master plan for transportation for the entire Tidewater region and not just the separate cities. Until that happens, things will continue to get worse and not better.

Just going through the motions is business as usual for Washington. Every fix they introduce includes tons more backdoor agreements and concessions to their special interests.

IMO we are stuck in an endless cycle of corporate greed and fiscal neglect. The best we can do as citizens is not to support corrupt business, call-out the corrupt leadership, and live within our means.

It's time to trade the glamour-4x4s in for reasonable transportation, and downsize frivolous spending. Spend more time at home, cook your own meals, and keep your tax dollars in town supporting local business vs foreign interests.

While I certainly value and appreciate the support for light rail, since when did the House of Delegates become part of the executive branch? Since when did they go in the business of becoming an operating entity? Since when did the House of Delegates take credit for authorizing a program but providing absolutely no funding to actually build the project they have approved? Federal money can't be included unless the project is included in the area transportation plan created and approved by the MPO and the Commonwealth, and the state also has a planning process for rail projects and of course this project has never been submitted to either, so essentially we have a branch of the Legislative body acting as if it were the executive branch. Regretfully, this is just another part of an elaborate hoax conceived by the leadership of the House and the republican party to make it look like they are do

"My pass was $127/mo and it doubled my commute time...(It's not NY where the trains leave every three minutes.) "

San Diego's train is very quick. Some of the routes you had to get off and on to a bus line for outreaching areas, but aside from that it was great. Cheap and quick. Did I mention air conditioned?

It's rare, but Mike Barret is right on this one.

You don't want additional light rail, you don't want to fund transportation, you don't want to ride an HRT or Max bus, you don't want to carpool, and you don't want to save on energy costs. Just what the heck do you want that makes any sense?

$232,000,000 to complete from Norfolk to Newtown. From Newtown to Oceanfront at least double that figure. At minimum, if charging $1.00 each way you need 232 million paying passengers not including debt service, various employee wages, benefits, bonuses, overtime, additional bus and trolley support, new railroad signals and gates at every street crossing backing up traffic all along the corridor, maintenance, and energy costs to propel the train. At $10.00 you need 23.2 million riders to break even on base cost. So at $470 million to $500 million? Who wants to drag around a beach tote and cooler all over in the hot heat waiting on trolleys, buses, and a light rail? Contractors hire subcontractors who don't get paid timely or at all, lawsuits are filed, there are "stop work" orders, work stoppages, sickouts, tax-payer bailouts, reality. Stop dreaming of open roads, people are moving

What bothers me most is the perception that the route is ill planned at best. Secondly, why are they going to pour money into technology that is not the most efficient? The real problem is the sprawl fostered by the ill planned transportation policies created. Sprawl is what has caused the traffic congestion and contributed to pollution. Least this is a step away from that to a more compact transit-oriented development, just not a well thought out one.

http://www.edf.org/article.cfm?contentid=2659

We voted on this and we voted NOT to have light rail in Va Beach. So what they're saying is that I voted to NOT have something and I voted in the majority, however it's gonna happen anyway and I've gotta help pay for it. What else should I expect from the Communistwealth of Virginia? I would shout RENO here but apparently, elections and ballots don't count.

Not that facts have to be used in forming an opinion ... but there are some aspects of the light rail bill that probably matter. First, the bill directs VDOT to issue an RFP for private companies to bid on building the line to make a profit. In order to do this and because Virginia Beach Council rejected the idea recently, they would have to spend hundreds of thousand of dollars to look at the right of way, the design requirements and the likely ridership levels to even make a bid - if they are interested after that. Then they would probably have to charge a fee for the ride (remember ... in order to make a profit and the state doesn't want to pay anything) that would appeal to only the Lexus hot lane riders. How many bids do you think that will attract? But hey, the headlines are great. Then, there's the matter of tolls. If you liked the abusive driver fees, you'll love the tolls the House of Delegates want t