Plan would create commission for Beach's budget process

I guess it does. Your perspective and mine are 180 degrees out of sync. That's for sure.

Well, it all depends upon your perspective.

Well Mr. Barrett, you could have fooled me. If some of the past spending practices of VB city council have been prudent and fiscally responsible, then I would hate to see what would happen if they were to go full tilt.

Frankly, in regard to your comment that..."All that I or any citizen of Virginia Beach would ask is that city council spend tax money collected from me in an efficient and prudent manner and exercise some fiscal responsibility..." I find myself to be in agreement with you.

Well, at this point, I have not seen the email you speak of and have no proof or otherwise that it exists, so I will leave it at that. I have no formal or otherwise association with the VBTA, or John Moss. I will admit that I have not been happy with my representative (Jim Wood) on city council. However he is not up for re-election. All that I or any citizen of Virginia Beach would ask is that city council spend tax money collected from me in an efficient and prudent manner and exercise some fiscal responsibility. With that said, the only member I think deserves to keep their seat on council is Reba McClanan.

Well Keith, I have that in writing, and of course none of the VBTA folks who received the same e-mail have issued a denial herein, even when I have given them the opportunity to do so. Why not? We can only assume that they know I and others have it in writing, and to deny it would only open them to further derision. So they attempt to try to simply kick back at me and others who say hey, wait a minute, a policy to fire every blue collar worker in the city and replace them with contractors is absurd on its face. Can you imagine how responsive Halliburton would be to your complaint that the ditch in front of your house needed to be cleaned out? My point was simply that the city does use contract labor for many jobs, and if that is the most efficient and effective way to get quality work at the lowest price, they have gone for that alternative for many tasks. The criticism I have leveled at John Moss and the VBTA, those who have initiated the RENO campaign, is that it is heavy handed and reveals a federal government technique bias.

What full exchange? The previous posts have been you trashing the VBTA, The DEW Team or The Dont DEW it team, and Reid Greenmum. I haven't found anything that said that Moss wanted to fire all VB govt. employees, close the recreation centers, and replace them with contractors. Only you said that. However, contractors don't have the job security that govt. workers have. God forbid a govie get laid off. The end of civilization as we know it!

When was the last time you heard somebody say...."Anything private business can do; the government can do better"?

Just curious.

Well Keith, perhaps you should read the full exchange before you offer your opinion. I pose no objection to contract employees; just the comment by John Moss's sycophant that all blue collar city workers should be fired and replaced by contractors. Are you defending that statement? Do you believe it would be wise public policy to implement that without any analysis or review of the task at hand? Do you believe that every blue collar employee deserves to be fired? That is what was advocated, and I find that to be repulsive on its face. As an employee of a private company, I certainly know and appreciate the value of private enterprise; that said, I also appreciate and value public employees as well. There are good and bad performers on both sides of that equation. But to advocate as public policy that all city blue collar employees should be replaced with contractors is as irresponsible as it is repulsive.

Mike states "Well, I'm glad you had a good laugh. Fact is, I find most retired federal bureaucrats have that same sense of entitlement about their own opinion; that is, anyone who disagrees with them is either mentally impaired or incapable of understanding their superior experience."
Gee, I have heard that same attitude expressed by Mr. Barrett in ones opinion of the MPO or the HR entities. The unelected bureaucrats who think they know best for Tidewater and traffic congestion. So, no one is mentally impaired or incapable of understanding as long as Mr. Barrett agrees with with the writers opinion. I see! As for contractors versus government workers, remember the airlines. All that changed there was a salary increase for the same screener to be a federal employee vice the contractor he/she already was. To quote former rep. Tom Daschle, D-SD, "You have to federalize in order to professionalize". What rubbish!

Another shrimp on the barbie?

What kind of sick person sells a dead parrot to a blind kid?

Her name is Samsonite. Yeah, Samsonite.

Well, I'm glad you had a good laugh. Fact is, I find most retired federal bureaucrats have that same sense of entitlement about their own opinion; that is, anyone who disagrees with them is either mentally impaired or incapable of understanding their superior experience. Just like John Moss. Fact is, laugh all you want, but the City of Virginia Beach has thousands of dedicated city employees who perform exceptionally well. Now the RENO/DON'T DEW IT TEAM advocates (they can meet in an telephone booth) have a much differenct view; that is, any city employee is lazy and should be replaced, and any elected official is incapable and unworthy of re-election. Neither is a view I share, and in fact, anyone who would take such a position reveals a significant lack of knowledge and an attitude that I find to be repugnant.

to see the word value and government in the same sentence! I laughed so hard I was tempted to call the rescue squad to resuscitate me. I was afraid of a tax increase to cover the bill! Ok lets do it the other way, have the government take over all private enterprise....or have we fought wars to avoid that??

Oh, that's classic. A pronouncement just like John Moss likes to do. No bother to study or understand the task and its requirements; just the federal bureaucratic attitude that he always knows best and the only real consideration is price, not value. Let me ask you again when the water in your subdivision of off because a tree fell and the crew from public utilities can't find the street because they just were hired by a contractor who wants to pay as little as he can and did not bother to train his workers. Or the blue collar guy from the public works shop who must respond to that same incident, mobilize a work crew overnight so the street can be repaired so you don't get delayed getting to work. My point is simply that a blanket demand to fire all blue collar workers and replace them with hired contractors is not only an outrageous statement, it shows an inherent prejudice against government workers and a failure to value public service which I don't share.

the vast MAJORITY of blue collar jobs needs to be contracted out. It is NEVER the role of government entities to displace private enterprise.

Well actually, you misunderstand. Fact is, the city uses contractors for many tasks including landscape maintenance. It is certainly a legitimate management issue to analyze a task and decide how that task can best be accomplished in terms of quality, cost, and service. That said, that is not what has been proposed by the Moss sycophant who claimed that the city should...."contract all blue collar work except essential safety and security positions." No analysis of what is best for us and the city, just fire existing personnel and hire contractors. First of course they ignore that the city staff does contract out when that is the best and most economical method, and second, it reveals the true attitude of this bunch of former federal bureaucrats that they always know best. No mention of course of the $16,000 hammer and the other cost overruns identified in past awards from Senator Proxmire.

Virginia Beach has grass cutters "landscape technicians" working towards a retirement that can't be funded. And "mikey" doesn't think the job needs to be eliminated and competitively bid. Government gone amuck!

Well, thanks for the advice. The moment that VBTA members stop packing each forum with RENO is the same time I will stop linking the DON'T DEW IT TEAM with them. Fact is, they are simply the successors to that campaign, and given the fact that the campaign was so unsuccessful, you would think they would attempt to reach out to a broader audience in order to swell their numbers. Fact is, there is good reason for a fiscally conservative group that would advocate for lower taxes, but the way to achieve that end is much different than either the DON'T DEW IT TEAM or the RENO team of Moss and his sycophants has advocated. Just like the DON'T DEW IT TEAM, Moss would simply cut all he could, even advocating firing blue collar city workers and replacing them with contractors, just like the Feds did. In other words, quality is replaced with indifference. Not a very smart formula.

Mike, so far I count about 5 posts in this one blog where you beat that dead horse. Let it go! DEW was years ago. Let it go.

How about Mike Barrett and Pat Murphy as members of the butget team?

You can't let it go, can you Henry. But of course you know quite well that the referendum was advisory, that citizens thought that if they voted for a park the city actually had the funds to build one, and further, the fact that you say the CCO had bad attendance does not trump the full occupancy, the thousands of visitors and citzens there everyday, and the fact that a park is actually there at the present time. Further, the project provides a fiscal dividend to the city every year, a dividend that along with the projects in various TIF's, reduces the tax rate we pay on our homes. That is the definition of a smart investment, and is the result of a long and prudent planning process by the RAAC, the IDA, the Planning Commission, and the City Council. Lastly, as you well know, the "DON'T DEW IT TEAM" candidates who ran on a platform of opposing the 31st Street project lost badly, as you so correctly will their reincarnation, the RENO crowd.

First of all, Reid's Budget hole was $55 million.

Citizen support for 31st Street?!? One, 58% voted against it in May, 2000. Two, when the CCO held their 2006 Banquet at the Hilton, it was the lowest attendance in years. Residents don't want to do business there.

As for the VBTA, compare the 2000 DEW Team finance reports to the 2006 O'Connor and Krause reports. The VBTA has veered so far to the extreme right that the vast majority of their former donors shun them. That all they could do in 2008 is Moss and Shuler tells everyone that the group is on life support.

As for Reid, I can't wait for the multiday tantrum he throws when nobody from the VBTA is appointed to the Budget Commission. Can't forget him going ballistic when the VBTA was kept off the Blue Ribbon Budget Task Force.

Then, maybe we should appoint both Mike Barrett and Reid Greenmun to the Budget Commission - and televise the meetings. They should lead VBTV in ratings.

Ira, not nice,,, but funny.

First, the RENO supporters will need to step up and run for office. When they are done re-electing no one their will be no one left. In fact, you may end up with worse than you started with. It's sort of a democratic anarchy which is strange and oxymoronic.

Do you all think Dyer realizes that picture makes him like Jim Carrey's character in Dumb and Dumber? Bob, let's work on this buddy.

Anti-tax zealot... no, over taxed yes.

Just last year the city admitted it had been paying for medical insurance for dependents of retirees without authorization from city council. The cost, as I recall, was in the many millions over a period of years. As far as I know this issue has never been resolved.
I guess the taxpayers are still being bilked for that gaffe. Anyway, an overview from the bottom up could only benefit all involved.

If invited, I'm willing to sit on the Commission and help put the budget together. 1.76 billion dollars seems like it should be the most important thing council does...

Yes, this new mantra is just like the program of the DON'T DEW IT TEAM. They built their whole election campaign against the 31st Street park, garage, and hotel. And of course, they lost badly; seems most right thinking citizens liked receiving a park right away, getting a place to park at the oceanfront, and stimulating the construction of a convention grade hotel that would contribute to the tax base so our tax rate could be lower. Fact is, that is exactly what happened, and even though the voters defeated the "DON'T DEW IT TEAM" they are now reincarnated as John Moss et al under the banner of RENO. I suspect the same result awaits these anti tax zealots because they still just don't get it. Sometimes you have to invest to ensure your future prosperity, and the public private ventures like the 31st Street Park, Town Center, the parking deck at Lynnhaven, and even sand replenishment at Sandbridge, have all stimulated investment and increased the tax base that has returned a fiscal dividend and helped reduce the tax rate. RENO/DON'T DEW IT TEAM, losers again.

RENO ftw!

Oh, that's classic; not only can't you read, but you don't get the point either. Please continue to use the acronym RENO all you want. I certainly don't want you to stop, I certainly support your right to use it, and I am glad to see you use it as much as you wish. Glad we got that cleared up. Of course, I will continue to point out the those who use the term RENO are simply the reincarnation of the DON'T DEW IT TEAM, the largest group of political losers still around. And one of their scribes has recently written a manifesto for John Moss indicating all the steps they would take if they had the power to do so. Things like fire all blue collar workers and replace them with contractors. Close non mandated services like libraries, recreations centers, art museums, concert venues, and cut back city services like agriculture programs, economic development, houusing and neighborhood preservation, and human services. I am sure you will support these steps as well. I won't. I hope your RENO campaign is just as successful as the Don't DEW it Team.

I don't belong to any organization, just a tax payer here who will say what he wants regardless of your thoughts. Last I checked, I was legally entitled to do so. You're entitled to your thoughts as well. I'll continue to say RENO...I wonder why you might not like this idea. You see, I really think that we can do better, who knows if we don't try huh, and we are entitled to better. May you receive the rewards today that you so justly deserve my friend.