Light-rail costs pile up as more pilings are found in creek

Was the same group of consultants for in Norfolk Tide used in the VA beach convention center and told them an anchor hotel was not needed for the center. Then after it was built another group stated it was both were paid of course. I think they are hiring politicians instead of consultants. Because politicians say anything to get elected and reelected and once on office most have a way of forgeting what they promised. Plus it seems personnel responsibility goes to who ever donate the most money and infulence. Some call it public service many use it to punish the public and line their pocket for the next election.

This council knows exactly what they are doing. Simply put; they cut the costs to get the federal money,and now they are going to have the costs overrun because the kick backs will keep coming. Here is a perfect way to squeeze the public monies and filter it out to contractors who will grease the palms. What is worse is that when the federal infrastructural money starts to be dolled out they will be right in line to get more. Norfolk has no transparency and no recourse to hold elected officials to any standard or expectation. Try to call them out on it and then that individual really has to watch out for themselves.I'm all for public transportation and green technology but the city of Norfolk council and mayor are exploiting the need for selfish gain. Broad creek is not that deep and unfortunately neither are the citizens of Norfolk.

The level of incompetence with this project is astounding! More and more it seems like the city of Norfolk hired idiots for consultants for this project and didn't double check their work. If there is a record book for stupidly handled projects, this one should rate right up there. I may be all for light rail, but it should be built with a level of efficiency.

Having driven over the Broad Creek bridge many time since the start of light rail construction, I have noticed men and equipment working on both sides of the creek every time I crossed. With at least one low tide during daylight hours and some neap tides thrown in for good measure, why wasn't this noticed by construction crews right away? "Hey Jake! If that's not more than 20 piles out there, I'll eat my hard hat!"

It's nice to know that we have so many people responding to this article that know soooo much about land surveying. Things like this happen on most major construction jobs. Heck, I wonder how many times the VNG contractor laying the gas pipeline from Norfolk to Newport News is going to hit unforeseen utilities or obstructions not shown on the construction plans......

You think this is bad. "You ain't seen nothing yet."

“When the water receded, dozens more pilings poked through the surface. There were 260 in all.

Hampton Roads Transit's board on Thursday approved spending an extra $369,200 to remove the rest. The agency's change order states that the number of pilings was "underestimated at 20, due to pre-existing piles not being visible except at low tide."

$369,200 to remove 260 pilings? That comes to about $1420 per piling. That sounds to me like some real serious tax bucks for essentially just pulling a big rotten stick out of the mud and hauling it away. Where do I sign up to get a piece of this action?. I come highly qualified as I can count higher than twenty. It may be the Tide when it is finished, but it looks to me more like the Gravy Train right now. All aboard!

SO...is the city going to request a refund from the consultant? Unbelieveable!

Your link to that blog is partially correct. Yes, it would increase the wages of people already in that line of work. However, as their wages increase they hire new people (ie. people to hold up shovels, we see that all the time along construction sites). If there is a large project going on in a certain town, the workers need somewhere to eat and sleep. The materials need to be made in factories then need to be shipped across the country. These are just a few examples of how the initial money will trickle across the rest of the economy. My point is don't read a story, especially someone's blog, and think it is the end all be all.

citizens of Norfolk, please, if you can let's move!, and if you can't move, please vote the idiots out in may 2010! Ward 2, t. whidbly, ward 3, a. burfoot, ward 4, p. riddick, Ward 5, r.w. wright and ward 1, don williams, are all up for re-election!the only one that is not elected but wholly responsible for these continuous blunders is Mr. Townes, how dare he demand more of our Norfolk taxpayer money,between the incompetance of NRHA and this Light Rail fiasco, we norfolk taxpayers don't have a chance of affording decent communities in norfolk. I also can't believe that the city has the audacity to raise my real estate accessment another $4,000 this year just to get more blood from my anemic self. So in the past four years my humble abode accessment has increased from $110.000 to $414, 000.00 for taxation purposes, resale value according to my bank is $265.000.00 maybe,I cannot support any city council incumbant ever again.

Submitted by dokein on Fri, 01/23/2009 at 12:33 pm.
Ms. Messina, how about rounding out this article with a little investigative follow-up. I'd look into it myself, but seeing how reporters actually get paid for that sort of thing...Use the Freedom Of Information Act to find the date and time of the survey, and compare to the NOAA tide level data. As weak as the contractor's excuse is, I'd question whether they did a survey at all. Check whether their argument holds any water at all, and see whether or not the low tide was unusually high that day.

I can answer that for you, he did it on his way back from his lunch break and it went like this.......Sam, that sure was a great shrimp salad don't you agree? Oh Shyt, can you slow down a little while crossing this bridge, I need to count the pilings for this "Light Rail" thing. 1,2,3,.....forget it we'll just say 20.

So the engineer said there are 20 pilings to be removed and on that the contractor based his bid. Did he not look himself before he bid the job? Has the tide not been low enough since then to see these pilings? Has NO ONE else noticed the extra 240 pilings until now? Or did they (TRT) know and this is part of the "low ball" estimate joke?

Just another example of what happens when you lie and low-ball the cost to trick taxpayers, state, and federal government into thinking this pig-in-a-poke was a good idea. Tide of failure rides again!

Maybe they should have hired an engineering firm that was smarter than a fifth grader. Come on, only 20 piles to hold up a railway bridge? I can't even imagine someone would write that in a contract, let alone be dumb enough to sign it! Shows a lack of competent management at HRT.

What happened to the old railroad bridge? Norfolk Southern freigth trains msut be heavier than light rail cars......

I would think the city would hire a QUALIFIED consultant. Hell , a six year old can count pilings. A qualified consultant working around water should ask if the level fluctuates with the tide.

http://robertreich.blogspot.com/2009/01/stimulus-how-to-create-jobs-without.html

I should have used quotation marks.

Jayd, you might be right, we may ALL be riding the white elephant, because once it is done, we may all have to sell our cars to be able to pay the tax increases. It will also be free, seeing that the LTR will be run on an honor system for tickets. You pay your fare, put the receipt in your pocket. No ticket windows, collectors, etc., so you can just ride all you want for free.... whoops, I mean on the taxpayers dime.

the difference with the cost of road signs.
Contractor $165,000 for x number of signs
City $ 50,000 for x number of signs
Is the city cost inclusive (time and materials)?
If so, then the contractor profit would had been $115,000, not bad!

What other city services could be utilized to lower the cost of this project?

"It's unacceptable; it's inexcusable," Councilman Barclay C. Winn said when informed of the change by a reporter after the meeting.
"The consultants ought to pay for that.... We keep getting beat up and beat up and beat up by their mistakes," he added.
Sorry Moron the Buck should stop on the City Council's desk!
Michael Townes, HRT chairman and CEO, said he does not blame the subcontractor, who he said did "a very professional job."
"When you get into construction, you get unforeseen conditions," Townes said. "It's the same thing when you get under the streets of downtown Norfolk. You're never sure what you'll find."
"That's why you have contingencies."
Again, sorry Moron a 15 year old should know that when you are looking in water for pilings you should check it at low tide. If this is the crap they are teaching you idiots in college we need to quit sending people to them! We need all new Council people who will fire the Morons running these so called Authorities. Until then you will continue to get the SHAFT!!! Keep voting for Democraps they run all the Major Cities in this country and do you see the shape they are in.

I hate to open this can of worms but....... When this job was priced the price of steel was through the roof. Since then the price of steel fell through the floor. IMO the city should receive a large credit for the difference of the steel costs. If they dont they (or the taxpayes) got robbed! This credit should go toward these unforeseen conditions. The VP should look into this and see what they come up with.