The Virginian-Pilot
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VIRGINIA BEACH
It was no town-hall meeting on health care - that's for sure.
About 100 mostly laid- back residents - and about half as many city officials and consultants - turned out Wednesday night for the first public meeting on a possible light-rail project in Virginia Beach. The meeting was largely about the bureaucratic process for getting a project off the ground, but residents got to meet the people behind the effort.
Hampton Roads Transit is conducting a $5.7 million study to answer the basic question: What kind of mass transit could work in the Beach? The study, due next year, is expected to nail down details on light-rail routes, cost, the number of riders, the location of park-and-ride lots, road closures, the environmental impact and noise. A bus rapid-transit system is also an option. So is extending light rail to Norfolk Naval Station.
The study's completion would open the door for federal funding, and competition is fierce for those dollars, HRT President Michael Townes told residents. Any project is at least six years away.
Meanwhile, Virginia Beach is expected to soon close a $40 million deal for the old 10.6-mile railroad corridor between Newtown Road and the Oceanfront that could be used to link to Norfolk's line, which is under construction.
The City Council has not decided whether there will be a referendum. Voters rejected light rail in a nonbinding 1999 referendum that led City Council members to abandon the effort.
Since Wednesday's meeting at Princess Anne High School was not a public hearing, residents did not speak out in a structured format. But many shared opinions on light rail in interviews. Some were skeptical, some were optimistic.
Damian Seitz, an architect, said he hoped light rail could increase the Beach's stature as a city and might help it attract a professional sports team.
"It would help put us in a different class of city," he said.
Bill Pope, a retired Navy commander and president of the King's Grant community civic league, worried that Norfolk would stand to benefit more than the Beach unless the light rail went to the city's convention center and to the Oceanfront. As it stands now, the line stops at Birdneck Road.
He also felt that despite the long study process, the decision to pursue light rail had already been made.
"I just feel like we're playing against a stacked deck," Pope said.
In the fall, HRT will schedule five workshops on station location and design, officials said.
Some people living close to the line, such as Craig Sneed of the Eureka Park neighborhood, worried that the city might take his property for the project. Still, he said the idea of hopping on a train to Harbor Park in Norfolk is appealing.
Many wondered how people not living near the rail corridor, which splits the city running roughly parallel to Interstate 264, would get to the line.
"How are people in Great Neck and Green Run going to get there?" resident Kevin Baird asked.
Another public meeting will be held tonight at the convention center from 6 to 8 p.m.
Aaron Applegate, (757) 222-5122, aaron.applegate@pilotonline.com
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HRT stands to make a bundle on this deal.
I agree with Reid. I believe that this is all a show and that it has already been decided that VB WILL implement light rail regardless of whether the residents want it or not, whether they want to pay for it or not and whether it will cost some people to lose their homes or businesses to build light rail stations. Remember 31st street. The city IS afraid of a referendum, but regardless of the outcome, it will proceed on and indebt the citizens of VB with higher real estate taxes to pay for this boon-doggle. They will sell the idea that they have already bought (or will buy) the old Circuit City building and the abandoned rail cooridor from Norfolk & Southern. After-all, what will be the use of owning the abandoned corridor, but for light rail? So, grab your ankles folks and buy an extra supply of K-Y jelly, because light rail and higher real estate taxes will come to a tax bill near you.
Light Rail Costs Less to Operate
Keith,
LRT is always cheaper to operate than buses. According to the National Transit Database, the national average in operating costs to move one passenger one mile is 60 cents per mile on a bus. The national average for LRT is 40 cents per mile.
LRT operating expenses include track, catenary, station, and car maintenance, and of course salaries to operate the trains. The bus costs include those categories that are similar, but they don't include monies to repair the damage caused by the buses as they pass over our roads and highways.
Hampton Roads Transit is currently just slightly above the national average at 62 cents per mile.
It's also important to note that typically buses recoup about 15% to 20% through the fare box, while LRT averages around 40% to 50%. Hampton is currently at 25%.
So if the taxes go up, it's far more likely that it will be for the buses or some other reason, rather than LRT.
Developers don't want referendum, they already paid for Sessoms
Those poor developers, they fear placing the question of constructing Light Rail on the ballot because they already spent hundreds of thousands of dollars buying off City Council and the planning department. They demand a return on their "investment". The proposed light rail project is all about more development and the abuse of local government to enrich those that have bought their "access" to local government. But the developers aren't the folks that will be stuck paying the billions required to build Mr. Barrett's TOD "vision" - it will be the taxpayers (federal, state, and VA Beach). Isn't it interesting that Jane Whitney of HRT is married to William "Jack" Whitney, Jr. who leads VA Beach's Planning Department (PD)? The PD writes the Comprehensive Plan which has been designed to promote Light Rail with its "Strategic Growth Areas". The fix is in folks and the so called "public input process" is a big con job to try to pretend complaince with the Federal requirements.
Drown out the VBTA
Saying that light rail is too expensive is absurd when it is clear that building roads is too expensive as well. Point is, transportation is the foundation of prosperity for all of us. This corridor is already full of roadways that cannot be expanded without tremendous disruption including the taking of residential and commercial property. Light rail, on the other hand, will use a ROW that had been used for rail service to industrial and light industrial property that is now served by trucks. Light rail will not reduce congestion on roadways, but it will be part of the solution to solve gridlock that threatens to curtail our great lifestyle at the Beach. Delegate Tata can read the tea leaves; the voting public is overwhelming in favor of light rail, and those who keep pushing the anti light rail talking points from the VBTA are destined to be drowned out by those who want this alternative means of transportation.
Light rail is a hole to throw money into.
Light rail is a hole to throw money into. How many more five million dollar studies and no votes do we have to have. The people said No. They don't want it.
People did not want to ride light rail when we had it before. If enough people had wanted to ride light rail they would have kept it instead of taking it out. Light rail used to go all the way to Cape Henery around the loop and back to Norfolk the other way. They did away with light rail because people did not want it.
Put the Buses on the HOV lanes ....
Anybody want to ask whose pockets are getting filled if the Light Rail goes through? Anybody get the connection; it's not the Bus Connection. Is it that If You Build It They Will Come Mentality like building the really ugly VBCC with single layer P/L's condemning many private properties & trees just bcuz they could.... so then they asked for more $$ to build a Big Hotel next to the VBCC, bcuz that wasn't the draw they thought.... but we can't build a big Hotel bcuz of line of Sight on the Radar?... or did we give other Private Partnerships all the $$ .... did some one put the cart b4 the horse and now needs a light rail for that pony to race on?
Instead of Developing every inch of God's Green Earth, how about we use some of these hard earned tax dollars to Develop the young minds in VB so that they can work hard, be good Responsible Citizens and use their minds & imaginations to create re-newable energy, find solutions, invent futures for themselves. We don't always need to attract outside business. we have great untapped intelligence here. Let's have some faith that we can grow some business of our own. The new Green Line!
Put the Buses on the HOV lanes if they want to get
Green line?
Where is this green line any way?
Put the Buses on the HOV lanes...
Just say NO to the Proposed Light Rail. We can stop the Train by stopping Federal Funding. My house would be a Station, a Parking Lot or Access there to... Gee, HRT can't provide shelter for people waiting for the bus now... They are going to wipe out the homes of people who's Transportation is the Bus, people who support Public Transportation daily. The rest of VB isn't going to take a transfer to the Light Rail Station, or drive to the Light Rail Station and pay to park their vehicle. They aren't even going to drive out of their way to get to the Station... so why should I give up my house. AS A CITIZEN I will be on the move to save our homes. Eminent Domain for Socio Economic Cleansing is Immoral! yeah, yeah, yeah, it is for the greater good... yada yada yada... lip service.. smiling faces... must not be their homes with the Wolf at the Door! too funny I am an Environmentalist. I support Public Transportation, Bike Trails, Low Environmental Impact, Renewable Energy Sources... but I like my house, walking & biking everywhere I can... I support Federal Funding for Enhanced Bus Service & more bikeways. Anybody want to ask whose pockets are getting filled if the Light Rail goes thro
Earlier transit systems have serious design flaws
Buses and carpools leaving/returning to the Silverleaf Park and ride aren't able to bypass congested Independence Blvd. traffic between the park and ride and the I264 interchange. Compounded by the design disaster of the Independence/I264 interchange itself, where VDOT refused to include provisions for the city's plans to widen Independence (thus the split northbound lanes and limited southbound width).
Left lane, and in many cases reversible HOV roadways where there were once medians, have a tendency to require buses and carpools to cross congested normal lanes. Without a means to bypass the congestion much of the benefit of the HOV facilities isn't present and they aren't heavily used.
The I564 HOV lanes end quite a distance from what is by FAR the most popular Naval Station destination (the pier area). Commuters using the HOV lanes are still delayed in traffic between the HOV termination and the piers, significantly reducing the motivation to use HOV.
PLEASE don't make mistakes like that with light rail! It's already looking grim with the small park and rides planned for the Norfolk segment.
etc
Why dont you face the facts that light rail wont fix grid lock, people that have cars will drive them, they wont ride bus or a train that wont meet their schedule, you keep saying that it will help grid lock, it wont, show me one study where another city introduced light rail and their grid lock problems changed. You just want to look like a classier city because light rail is the flavor of the week now, whats wrong with being a small city? They are shoving this down peoples throats that dont want it, and if you dispute the fact that people dont want it hold a vote. If more people agree to it fine then build it, if not, stop wasting our money on over priced land, trumped up ridership estimates and benefits to gridlock.Put the tolls back on 64 and fix the damn road finally, I wont even drive on it due to its lack of repair People dont mind paying their taxes when you use it to actually fix something, instead of trying to be something that your not, Virginia Beach will never be a big metropolitan city, People will never flock here because we have light rail, or a town center with streets named after NYC. Virginia beach is a small, military oriented moderate tourist area and there is