The Virginian-Pilot
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Building a parallel Midtown Tunnel and bringing back tolls came closer to reality Tuesday when state transportation officials announced an interim agreement with a private group to further study fixing one of the region's worst bottlenecks.
A consortium of private firms - Elizabeth River Crossings - wants to add a second tube to the Midtown Tunnel, refurbish the Downtown Tunnel and extend the Martin Luther King Freeway. Work would begin in 2011 and end in 2015.
The $1.3 billion to $2.1 billion proposal includes car tolls of $2 to $3 and truck tolls of $6 to $9 for both the Midtown and Downtown tunnels.
The Virginia Department of Transportation is reviewing how much money the state could contribute to reduce the tolls.
Already, $100 million has been set aside in the state's six-year road-building plan. Transportation Secretary Pierce Homer said recently that it would require $400 million to $600 million in state money to bring the tolls to an acceptable level. He said that money will likely have to be taken from other local road projects.
Hampton Roads leaders have said that a toll of around $1.50 would be more palatable to local motorists.
"I think another challenging set of issues will be the ability and willingness to accept tolls on a pre-existing facility, which has not been done in Virginia before," Homer said.
The Midtown Tunnel, with about 44,000 vehicles daily, is the busiest two-lane road east of the Mississippi River.
By signing the agreement, VDOT is not yet committing to the improvements but is advancing the required preliminary work, which includes refining cost estimates and toll rates.
The agreement calls for completing "a project feasibility assessment to determine if the project is economically viable," said VDOT spokeswoman Shannon Marshall.
Homer said the Midtown Tunnel should be the region's top road-building priority.
The Hampton Roads Transportation Planning Organization is working on prioritizing the region's road needs. In an early computer modeling exercise, the Midtown Tunnel ranked second behind expanding the Hampton Roads Bridge-Tunnel. The planning group is still tweaking the model.
"What is your highest achievable priority?" Homer asked. "The project is the Midtown Tunnel. Can the region stick by that? If not, it will be years before we have a doable project.
"These are multibillion-dollar investments and they don't happen overnight."
Debbie Messina, (757) 446-2588, debbie.messina@pilotonline.com
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Poor military and dependents...
It does not seem fair that all of the military and their families now have to pay to enter Portsmouth to get medical care...that is SO WRONG!!
Let's do the Math!
The Midtown Tunnel is the most traveled two lane road in the State of Virginia and the Downtown Tunnel has the highest vehicle capacity tunnel in the U.S. With the present day numbers of vehicles per day through those tunnels of simply 140,000 cars a day (not including trucks or multi axle cars) the income at $2.50 per car equals
$350,000 per day,
$2.45 million per week,
$127 million per year, and next that will be for fifty years totaling a whopping
$6,370,000,000.00 (that’s billon).
The estimated cost of the new tunnel, MLK extension, and retrofitting of both tunnels is only $850,000,000.00 to date. Can we say boondoggle and not only that; the company (Skanska) that is proposing this project is the same that is now building the Norfolk Light Rail with a cost overrun by over 40%! I question the ability to keep those tolls in perspective at all. Step up to the plate folks we need another Boston Tea Party NOW!
PRIVATE TOLLS=TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION. CALL YOUR CITY, STATE, AND FEDERALS POLITICAL REPRESENTATION AND LET THEM KNOW WE NEED A CHOICE. NO TOLLS ON OLD ROADS!
They're building a new tunnel
So it won't be a new toll on an old road. It'll be a new toll on a new road. And to build new roads (desperately needed in this case) you've got to come up with some kind of money. It's either impose tolls or raise taxes.
If they're going to toll the downtown tunnel, though, the least they can do is redesign the eastbound side's merge with 464. Make it so the 464 traffic enters on the left instead of the right. That would make the berkely bridge safer and probably cut down on a lot of the congestion there.
$2000 a year
That is what it will cost you out of your pay before taxes assuming $3 a day used every weekday of the year round trip. Ridiculous. If you make $50,000 a year, almost the first two weeks of the year are used to pay for the toll. If you make $25,000 a year, the first month of your salary is used to pay for the toll.
Why the resistance to tolls?
Why the resistance to tolls? Almost all the bridges and tunnels around here started of with tolls and when the bonds were paid off they were removed. (I think they should have been lowered them and kept to pay for maintenance but, whatever.)
The Jordan Bridge, Berkley Bridge, James River Bridge, I264(old SR44 portion), Chesapeake Bay Bridge, Hampton Roads Bridge Tunnel, Coleman Bridge, etc.
The toll on the JRB in 1955 was $1.80. (Trucks were $4) That's about $14.00 today.
Jefferson once observed, toll financing provided a means of building highway facilities for which there was a need but which were too complex and costly to be constructed by the counties alone. I don't see what's changed except that now they are too complex and costly for the state either.
the problem is...
THey built the tunnels THEN tolled them, they want to Toll the existing two tunnels and THEN build THEN toll some more. this is the major problem people have with this! get a loan build it then toll it and make your money back!
Could you imagine the bottleneck with tolls at the downtown and midtown tunels. it would be a nightmare!!
Here's what's wrong:
The state is effectively giving away a significant piece of its property and it's transportation responsibilities in this region, and all it gets in return is a moderate expansion of the facility least likely to improve overall transportation in the region, which the citizens will now have to PAY to use. If VDOT is going to let a private company profit off of this state owned facility for generations to come, and free itself of all these maintenance costs, the least they could do is redirect those funds to another facility which will benefit THIS region (such as more lanes at the HRBT or a new untolled Uptown Tunnel connecting 564 to 164). Instead, they give us a plan without a single new major projects in this region for years to come, but plenty in Northern VA.
So...are you saying you're against the tolls :-)
"...the least they could do is redirect those funds to another facility which will benefit THIS region (such as more lanes at the HRBT or a new untolled Uptown Tunnel connecting 564 to 164)."
Um, I think the reason they are talking about allowing a private company to refurbish the Downtown tunnel is because we don't have the money to properly maintain it and adding a second tube at the Midtown is hardly to be considered a "moderate expansion" nor should the MLK be considered an insignificant improvement. Do you ever use the Midtown?
"a new untolled Uptown Tunnel connecting 564 to 164"
The maintenance funds wouldn't pay for the feasibility study on a 5 mile long bridge tunnel.
As far a Northern VA goes, there is no comparison between us. We don't have a rush hour compared to N. VA. We have a few problem spots and that's all.
Where to start?
Okay, this post is a bit dated but since I stumbled across it again I may as well respond:
I'm not opposed to tolls if they're done right and for the right reasons. With electronic tolling and no manual option it doesn't seem to add an unreasonable amount of overhead. And they can make a lot of sense on new facilities and private road initiatives. But tolling something that's already been paid for is wrong, and if you're talking about a federal interstate highway, it's generally illegal (23 USC 129).
I haven't heard VDOT claim that they lack the budget to maintaining the Downtown and the Midtown (but if you have a source let me know).
I think it is fair to call it a moderate expansion, especially compared to the cost. We'd get one vehicle additional lane in either direction by tolling six lanes that are currently free, and it won't connect to any limited-access highways in Norfolk.
Yes, I drive the Midtown fairly regularly, eastbound at rush hour. It adds a few miles to my commute vs the Downtown, so it takes about the same amount of time, but the backups are shorter so I find it less frustrating.
I can't speak to the cost of the Uptown Tunnel alternative. I've
"Uptown Tunnel" & Craney Island
I've only seen it presented as part of a 6-project package in the referrendum a few years back. But at least a portion of the feasibility study was already completed at that time. Possibly more expensive than the 50-year maintenance budget for the existing tunnels, but since that number hasn't been part of any of the public discussions of this proposal, I really can't say. And the Uptown would be a tunnel, with little or no bridge, only as long as the river is wide (about a mile) plus approaches. The rest is on land, and much of the highway connection will be built regardless for truck access to the new marine terminal. See www.craneyisland.info
And I'm not saying our traffic here is worse than DC, just that we deserve a fair share of funding in proportion to our tax base and our needs. See http://hamptonroads.com/2009/12/group-criticizes-lack-transportation-funding