NORFOLK
Saying they have run out of patience, a group of residents plans to kick off another petition drive to force city leaders to turn a chunk of land in East Ocean View into a park.
Norfolk officials say the drive is divisive and unnecessary. They hope to end the controversy in September, when the City Council is scheduled to discuss the issue.
"It's a huge waste of time and effort," City Councilman Barclay C. Winn said. "I don't know what they think they can accomplish by doing that. I wish they would wait."
Bill Kerry, who heads the Bay Oaks Committee, told the council last month that unless it acted within 30 days to rezone the property to recreation and open space, there would be another petition drive. The 30 days ended Thursday.
"Everything we've learned about what the city is doing, we learned through the newspaper," Kerry said. "They never communicate with us."
The committee grew upset over the issue five years ago. At the time, the group was told that no housing would be built on the site. But officials later acknowledged that their plans for the property included housing.
The council then voted to rezone the land to include housing and a park. Upset over the rezoning, the Bay Oaks Committee circulated petitions to force the city to undo the zoning.
The city challenged the validity of the petitions in court, but the Bay Oaks group prevailed in the Supreme Court of Virginia in June 2007. The council then unanimously reversed the zoning.
Last summer, committee officials met with Mayor Paul Fraim. They say they wrested a promise from him to stay in touch and work with the group.
In the past year, the council has discussed the issue at a retreat and held a couple of public hearings.
"We have not done anything to that property," Fraim said. "And we won't without talking to the Bay Oaks group."
If the group garners 800 signatures and the council does not schedule a vote on rezoning the land, the subject would go to a referendum, Bay Oaks officials say. Even so, the only thing the group can force the council to do is vote, Winn said.
"We could simply vote no," he said.
Winn said he urged the group to back off until after the council's September retreat. During the meeting, Planning Director Frank Duke is expected to discuss a way to reach a compromise with the group.
"The plan Frank will introduce is probably something the Bay Oaks people would like," Winn said. "A very significant portion of the land will be set aside as a park."
Duke won't reveal details of his plan other than to say that it includes some recreation and open space and housing. The land extends from 3rd Bay to 7th Bay streets along East Ocean View Avenue.
Harry Minium, (757) 446-2371, harry.minium@pilotonline.com
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Park issue
How quickly one forgets-the beach and park at East Beach was to be saved also so people could park and use the beach. What is it now???? Houses.Our elected officials need to be shown the door come next election.
mark, norfolk lacks a lot,
but foremost is qualified responsible leadership. Until we remove them from office we won't see much improvement.
Norfolk Lacks Park Space, Especially Medium to Large Parks
If you are not aware, Norfolk's park system is an embarrassment, especially in terms of the tiny amount of acreage devoted to parks in this City of 240,000 people and 42,000 acres of land. Only something more than 600 acres total is devoted to parks, 1.5% of the land in City. Compared to other cities across the nation, Norfolk is at the very bottom. And the Trust for Public Land has reviewed Norfolk's park system and said that more than anything Norfolk needs to add mid-size to larger parks (20 acres or more), of which Norfolk has only a very few.
Norfolk leaders are trying to increase our population and our population density, but are doing nothing to identify opportunities for new mid-size or larger parks. Adding a pocket park here or there, or improving an existing park like Town Point Park for more revenue producing festivals, does nothing to address the mid-size and larger park deficit.
The 21 acre Bay Oaks property is in public ownership, beautifully suited to be a park and located in an area identified by Trust for Public Land as needing a mid-size park. Compromise always sounds good, but Norfolk really needs all or very close to all of this 21 acres to begin to addre
$11.5 Million
Council has authorized $11.5 Million for renovation of Town Point park's 7 acres. They will also be razing Waterside. My question is why? Who will benefit from the Town Point park besides the downtown people? If out City can afford that kind of expense then Bay Oaks Park should be a breeze. No one is asking for "singing" fountans, we just want a park that will provide a sense of community for a crowded area.
A perfect example of how the city council has unterior motives
You have had your answer from the citizens for five years. You continue this movement to ignor the will of the people and eventualy it will effect the change truely needed. Representation by the people and for the people. I for one think the council should go for broke and make their true intenions known so there is no room for misunderstnding. Certainly won't be able to make a claim that the voices of the citizens matter after this issue. I don't think the attorney would mind and the change must come for this city to evolve by the will of it's citizens who have had enough of the developers and the exploitation of those elected to represent who get into the game to exploit it
Where do we sign?
Where can we sign any petition to save Bay Oak's from more track housing? Does anyone know?
The Bay Oaks Group does not speak for EOV Residents
Most residents in EOV agree that the "Bay Oaks Park" land needs to be addressed. I feel that a mix of affordable housing and open space would be a great fit. This land is currently plagued by drug dealers, garbage, and other illegal activities. In its current state I don't even walk my dog there, glass, garbage, and other rubbish litter the park. I think 70% park/open space and 30% housing would be a good mix. I could also spur other development in this area. EOV is a jewel in the rough, to bad the city lacks the vision to invest in infrastructure and ridding the area of the people who make it unsafe. The residents want a mix of housing and open space. The Bay Oaks Group did not get an endorsement from the EOV Civic league, maybe the Ghent and Larchmont Civic League but not from the people who live there. We should compromise, but not let the city dictate the terms, as we know they rarely get anything done un
You still don't get it
What you say or do, does not matter to the the city councils in either city. They do what ever they want to do, not what the citizens that they are supposed to represent want them to do. If they, or their relatives, or even their good ol buddies can make money off of the taxpayers, that is what they will do their darness to do and protect. If they took an oath of office then they sure have broken that way many times. They up the taxes on us so they can give it to the developers(relatives or good ol buddies) instead of increasing the services due to the citizens in each city. They raise the taxes and fees on everything to help "build" the cities up. Yet when the people that voted them in office ask them for something, thinking that they would do as they should, they don't want to even put up a park. Now if was for Judy Boone or someone like her they would. It' sickening. No, it's just plain discusting.
Vocal Minority
This will be the same group of nothing better to do than complain if taxes are increased. Rather, they would make a park and thus no taxes are collected. Maybe this group would better spend there time doing volunteer work and doing something productive. How many people would actual go to this park? None of the existing city parks seems to be filled to capacity.
The referendum idea, now THAT really works!
We forced some items to come to referendums in VaBeach and found out how well this system works. We voted for the land that is now a hotel to remain a park. We also voted down the proposal for light rail. Good luck with YOUR City Council.
An Idea Out Of Atlanta
Ocean View can secede from Norfolk like Buckhead is wanting in Atlanta GA. Then this dirt lot can be used for a municipal building and K-12 school.
I love...
....a good fight, and I'm glad the Bay Oaks folks are not easily fooled and slight of handed by City Council.I'll put my X on your petition...you really should hang out at Wards Corner for a day and fill it up there...now there are some folks who have been slight of handed and would love to help...ps...we may need your help on a petition or two in the future!!!
Leave it as it is
Our family lived in a house at the corner of what is now 9th Bay Street and Pleasant Ave. during most of WWII. Back in those days, 9th Bay was simply 9th Street, and East Ocean View was a part of what was then Princess Ann County. Where we lived is now a vacant lot, probably owned by the East Ocean View Baptist Church. My Dad served as Elder when it was the East Ocean View Presbyterian Church. Mom would take my brothers and me down 9th Street, across East Ocean View Ave., and to the beach where I learned to swim. Once a group of sailors whistled at Mom as we returned from the beach. Words cannot capture Dad's consternation when we told him, "Mom's pretty enough to ba a sailor's girlfriend!"
Please, do not degrade that neighborhood further with more "improvements."
Who Owns This Property
A comment was entered about who owns this land. It is owned by the people that are making the protest, and all the other citizens of Norfolk. We pay for it each year with our property taxes. The citizens of Norfolk should be the one's that decide what to do with the property.
Yes, the city (and it's citizens) would make more money by putting houses there. Yes, we vote on council members that we think will make the best use of our money and property. But, if the citizens of Norfolk want that piece of property to remain a park, then the council must follow their wishes.
My personal wish is that it remain an open area. No recreational or structured type park amenities, just a nice open area to relax in. We need more places like that.
next to NRHA the worst part of
Norfolk is it's politicians, nothing is worse than these two. Using taxpayers money to fight taxpayers initiatives is so anti citizen. When did the politicians forget, as NRHA has, that they are public servants? and when did the public citizens forget that they are the government who should be controlling the politicians? Bay Oaks is Historic. Bay Oaks is accessable to every citizen of Norfolk, upon development it becomes private. What a loss that will be. Where's the Norfolk Tea Party II on this as well as the Bay Oaks Preservation committee? Oceanview should not look like downtown! Save the park!
Who owns the property?
Here's an idea, have the protesters put their money where their mouth is and buy the property for use as a park. Otherwise, what gives them the right to say this land can't be built on?
Pristine Peace
I drove past the property in question yesterday and I was surrounded by the emotion of peace. The hurries of the day, the noise of Ocean View Drive, the sounds of neighborhoods all disappeared in the beauty and peace of this open area. This is a place to park your car and your worries at the curb and just take a 10 minute peace walk to clear your head.
I am sure the city council and their friends could make some more money off this area of peace. I don't know how long it took to grow all this but I know it is irreplacable. I know you can't modify it without wounding this area. I know it is worth fighting for.
Trusting people that have already taken actions that they had to be sued to overturn their decisions is like trusting a snake that has already bitten you once.
If I remember right, is this
If I remember right, is this not the land that Norfolk Spent 100K+ of our taxes fighting the petions in court.
If its unnecessary, divisive
If its unnecessary, divisive and a waste of time, why doesn't the city just do what it said it would?
Divisive and unnecessary - that's what the mayor says...
Everytime he doesn't like something. I've seen it in print twice. It isn't "divisive" or "unnecessary" if the people want to engage in democratic processes. Who is he, a dictator, telling people what is allowed and what is not? I'll sign the petition!